Lawrence or Riva (or Chastain!): Who Will Win?

[McTeague]

So now dialogue = more difficult role?

I mean, sure. Delivering lines like 'Why did you order a raisin bran?', 'You're KILLING ME!', 'You're an ASSHOLE!' and all these football stats means that she has more to do?

In the first place, I shouldn’t even address this, because you obviously know you’re misrepresenting SLP. You perfectly know Lawrence has way more dialogue than that. You have Riva in your siggie and have about the most intolerant and prejudiced view on movies around here.

You have given SLP a 1
http://awardsdailyforums.com/poll.ph...do=showresults

Argo a 2:
http://awardsdailyforums.com/poll.ph...do=showresults

The Impossible a 1:
http://awardsdailyforums.com/poll.ph...do=showresults

Life of Pi a 6:
http://awardsdailyforums.com/poll.ph...do=showresults

Zero Dark Thirty a 4:
http://awardsdailyforums.com/poll.ph...do=showresults

Lincoln a 5:
http://awardsdailyforums.com/poll.ph...do=showresults

Among non-nominated films we’ve made polls for too: A 1 to Skyfall, a 1 to Flight, a 3 to Looper, a 4 to Marigold.

Your highest grades in those polls are 7 for Moonrise, Beasts and Master.

And of course your 10 to Amour.

So really, are you trying to convince anybody? You give a 1 to SLP (and many more) and act like all Lawrence has to say is “You’re an asshole!”, and you expect to be read as anything other than a weird near-troll? You either perfectly know Lawrence has much longer lines and scenes and banter than that, and you’re willingly misrepresenting it, or you genuinely think that’s all she says in the movie, in which case you’re simply deranged and nuts because it’s empirically provable that she has way more than that. So you choose. But in both cases, it’s pointless to argue with such a trollish guy who misrepresents things so stupidly so to create a useless argument, and who goes around giving below-5 grades to nearly everything.



And BTW, LAFCA, Austin, Ohio, Las Vegas, South Eastern. 2nd place at NSFC and NY. Considering she beat Chastain at NSFC and Riva didn’t appear at NY, yeah, Lawrence’s is easily the most consistently awarded female performance of the year.

[McTeague]

Did you read my post? I mentioned Holly Hunter. You're odd.

[Michael_Bay]

If one more person uses the "if they see Riva's performance she'll win" reasoning I am going to scream.

Stop it please. The moment you lay your eyes on Riva s performance, you can't unsee it.
You witnessed something that is divine,pure and magical.

[VannVicente]

In the first place, I shouldn’t even address this, because you obviously know you’re misrepresenting SLP. You perfectly know Lawrence has way more dialogue than that. You have Riva in your siggie and have about the most intolerant and prejudiced view on movies around here.

You have given SLP a 1
http://awardsdailyforums.com/poll.ph...do=showresults... etc..

You have put a lot of effort into making a counter-attack. Waaaay too much effort. How long did you spend tracking down all the polls he's voted in?

Also, if it helps, from someone who thinks that Amour is fantastic (a 10) while SLP is a great film (a high 8, or a 9 basically), I think that Riva's performance is better but Lawrence's is both great and more naturally AMPAS-y, so it'll win. So, yeah, does that give some perspective?

[Michael_Bay]

Do people know how hard Cotillard and Dujardin campaingned to brick back Oscar in France ?

They almost won every vote one hand-shake at a time.

The did it for 6 MONTHS, 24/7.

Sometimes campaign doesn't matter but still.

[McTeague]

Also, if it helps, from someone who thinks that Amour is fantastic (a 10) while SLP is a great film (a high 8, or a 9 basically), I think that Riva's performance is better but Lawrence's is both great and more naturally AMPAS-y, so it'll win. So, yeah, does that give some perspective?

That's what every sensible person does, not something to wear like a badge of honor. I was merely pointing out how pointless it is to argue with someone like NoirJo, not how pointless it is to argue with every Riva fan. I loathe Amour but I see the merit of its performances too, you're not some sort of enlightened being.

[Jeff Beachnau]

Did you read my post? I mentioned Holly Hunter. You're odd.

It was a joke.

And you know, it's not like Riva was silent the entire movie.

[VannVicente]

Do people know how hard Cotillard and Dujardin campaingned to brick back Oscar in France ?

They almost won every vote one hand-shake at a time.

The did it for 6 MONTHS, 24/7.

Sometimes campaign doesn't matter but still.

Brick?

Anyways, yeah, if your point is that Riva doesn't campaign, it's pretty obvious. Pretty much everyone acknowledges that. And in this case, it does matter since she's essentially a big unknown.

That's what every sensible person does, not something to wear like a badge of honor. I was merely pointing out how pointless it is to argue with someone like NoirJo, not how pointless it is to argue with every Riva fan. I loathe Amour but I see the merit of its performances too, you're not some sort of enlightened being.

Not saying anything dude. -_- Just came across wrong.

[Michael_Bay]

[QUOTE=VannVicente;1566200]Brick?

Anyways, yeah, if your point is that Riva doesn't campaign, it's pretty obvious. Pretty much everyone acknowledges that.

My point was that Cotillard and Dujardin probably campaingned harder than the average campaigning american actor/actress because of the french glass ceiling thing.

Plus Cotillard and Dujardin were both young, beautiful and glamourous and Hollywood kidnapped both, well Cotillard more than Dujardin, his roles in the next Scorcese and Clooney are minor.
Does Hollywood need Riva to thrive ?
Dujardin had the dog and the black and white silent movie trick ponny.
Cotillard was portraying the most famous french person in the world after General De Gaulles.

[Atonenent.]

Lawrence.

It's mostly all been said, so I won't list the obvious arguments except for the most important one: campaigning. Not only does she have Harvey on her side (and she's his most likely winner), but she's also been everywhere, while Riva didn't give the one speech she could that could make people aware who she actually is. Even Cotillard in 2007 - with an easier film, more attention including precursors and campaigning like crazy - struggled to win until the end. Riva has only appeared at LAFCA and NYFCC, yes?

If one more person uses the "if they see Riva's performance she'll win" reasoning I am going to scream.

Also, this is so dumb. While this argument wouldn't be applicable even if the signs pointed that Riva's performance is objectively better, there's no such thing. Forget the fact that Lawrence has done better than Riva with the critics and the televised awards, you can also just look at an awards group that picked Amour as their film of the year yet still thought Lawrence was equally as good as Riva. And these are highbrow critics that usually go for someone like Riva and very rarely with someone like Lawrence. The 'better performance' argument is simply invalid.

Of course, Riva still a major threat for the win, but this turning like the wind blows is silly.

[Moviefreak]

I still don't really buy this Oscar/BAFTA stat. Every single one of those women who won the BAFTA and then the Oscar had a SAG nomination or win. So what's a stronger stat, BAFTA win leading to an Oscar win or no one winning Best Actress without a SAG nomination?

[City Lights]

Screw this. I'm canceling the Best Actress race this year. NO ONE WINS.

[McTeague]

Screw this. I'm canceling the Best Actress race this year. NO ONE WINS.

Nicole Kidman wins a nanny for February 24th?

[City Lights]

Nicole Kidman wins a nanny for February 24th?

[Orlean]

Stop it please. The moment you lay your eyes on Riva s performance, you can't unsee it.
You witnessed something that is divine,pure and magical.

I don't think anyone here denies that.
It's just not that every great performance is the winner in the end. The Academy has often overlooked the best performance in favor of someone else.

I still think Lawrence takes it. Was anyone here really sure she'll win the BAFTA?
Though if Riva wins, I won't be surprised at all. Very interesting race. I only feel sorry for Chastain....

And if both, Chastain AND Lawrence loose.... Will that "fight" continue next year? (if their films are good)

[Aurelius]

I think Michael_Bay was trying to be sarcastic .

[Michael_Bay]

I think Michael_Bay was trying to be sarcastic .

Hum.

[NoirJo]

In the first place, I shouldn’t even address this, because you obviously know you’re misrepresenting SLP. You perfectly know Lawrence has way more dialogue than that. You have Riva in your siggie and have about the most intolerant and prejudiced view on movies around here.

You have given SLP a 1
http://awardsdailyforums.com/poll.ph...do=showresults

Argo a 2:
http://awardsdailyforums.com/poll.ph...do=showresults

The Impossible a 1:
http://awardsdailyforums.com/poll.ph...do=showresults

Life of Pi a 6:
http://awardsdailyforums.com/poll.ph...do=showresults

Zero Dark Thirty a 4:
http://awardsdailyforums.com/poll.ph...do=showresults

Lincoln a 5:
http://awardsdailyforums.com/poll.ph...do=showresults

Among non-nominated films we’ve made polls for too: A 1 to Skyfall, a 1 to Flight, a 3 to Looper, a 4 to Marigold.

Your highest grades in those polls are 7 for Moonrise, Beasts and Master.

And of course your 10 to Amour.

So really, are you trying to convince anybody? You give a 1 to SLP (and many more) and act like all Lawrence has to say is “You’re an asshole!”, and you expect to be read as anything other than a weird near-troll? You either perfectly know Lawrence has much longer lines and scenes and banter than that, and you’re willingly misrepresenting it, or you genuinely think that’s all she says in the movie, in which case you’re simply deranged and nuts because it’s empirically provable that she has way more than that. So you choose. But in both cases, it’s pointless to argue with such a trollish guy who misrepresents things so stupidly so to create a useless argument, and who goes around giving below-5 grades to nearly everything.



And BTW, LAFCA, Austin, Ohio, Las Vegas, South Eastern. 2nd place at NSFC and NY. Considering she beat Chastain at NSFC and Riva didn’t appear at NY, yeah, Lawrence’s is easily the most consistently awarded female performance of the year.

It's not my fault that these English-language films were mostly dreadful, according to my opinion. My favorite films of the year were Tabu, The Turin Horse, The Day He Arrives, Once Upon a Time in Anatolia, Amour, The Deep Blue Sea, Almayer's Folly and This Is Not a Film. Films that I give more than 8 stars out of 10. I feel like I'm supposed to explain myself for my taste and my film preferences.
Silver Linings Playbook is an atrocious example of making fun of mental illness. And I know all about mental illness, because I have relatives who suffer from serious issues. Its an utterly cliche film and while its opening scenes were somehow promising, because David O.Russell's kinetic direction gave the impression of a somehow intriguing and fresh film, it all collapsed and its third act was ridiculous. The acting was all over the place and the only saving grace was Jacki Weaver's subtle turn (who should have done more). I'm very strict when it comes to voting, but this is a film that I unfortunately disliked a lot. I'm not going to continue talking about the rest of these Oscar-nominated films, because I equally hated Argo and Les Miserables. Disastrous films. This is my opinion, so you'd better respect it before you start attacking me with your 'facts' (did you really search my post history? Really? )

Like it or not, I'm just not a fan of this year's Oscar nominees, except Amour, The Master, Moonrise Kingdom and Beasts. So you'd better respect my opinion instead of listing what I liked and what I didn't like. Or even claiming that I'm a troll (seriously, now?).

Also, what's wrong with loving Amour? Haneke has always been a hit-or-miss for me, but Amour is one of his crowning achievements and a wonderfully subtle and detailed approach to difficult themes. Still, this is my opinion. I saw you gave a 1 to Amour, should I start attacking you for your taste? Because I could definitely say this: 'He gave a 1 to Amour! He's misrepresenting (?) the film and Riva's performance!' and all this ridiculous nonsense. Art is subjective. I think you know that, don't you? But to claim that Lawrence had dialogue which makes her performance more demanding than Riva's is completely ridiculous. Since when having to deliver a lot of lines means that the performance is better than an (almost) silent one? I guess we should trash Samantha Morton's performance in 'Morvern Callar' because she barely has any substantial dialogue in the film. This makes no sense at all. Or even Holly Hunter in 'The Piano'? Wait, she couldn't speak, so that doesn't count. And you act as if Riva has no dialogue in the film. Aren't you a bit too biased against her film and performance?

Concerning Lawrence's performance, I thought it was a mess with no depth at all. What kind of strong dialogue did she really have? And what kind of depth did she bring to this cliche character? Does Jennifer Lawrence have charisma? She does. Is this enough to claim that this is a worthy performance? Not to me.


Now, that's enough. If you want to talk about this, you could send me a PM. Your arrogance and attitude towards the vast majority of the AD members has always been annoying, but this personal attack is on a totally different level. I end this argument here.

[McTeague]

It's not my fault that these English-language films were mostly dreadful, according to my opinion. My favorite films of the year were Tabu, The Turin Horse, The Day He Arrives, Once Upon a Time in Anatolia, Amour, The Deep Blue Sea, Almayer's Folly and This Is Not a Film. Films that I give more than 8 stars out of 10. I feel like I'm supposed to explain myself for my taste and my film preferences.
Silver Linings Playbook is an atrocious example of making fun of mental illness. And I know all about mental illness, because I have relatives who suffer from serious issues. Its an utterly cliche film and while its opening scenes were somehow promising, because David O.Russell's kinetic direction gave the impression of a somehow intriguing and fresh film, it all collapsed and its third act was ridiculous. The acting was all over the place and the only saving grace was Jacki Weaver's subtle turn (who should have done more). I'm very strict when it comes to voting, but this is a film that I unfortunately disliked a lot. I'm not going to continue talking about the rest of these Oscar-nominated films, because I equally hated Argo and Les Miserables. Disastrous films. This is my opinion, so you'd better respect it before you start attacking me with your 'facts' (did you really search my post history? Really? )

Like it or not, I'm just not a fan of these years' Oscar nominees, except Amour, The Master, and Beasts. So you'd better respect my opinion instead of listing what I liked and what I didn't like.

Also, what's wrong with loving Amour? Haneke has always been a hit-or-miss for me, but Amour is one of his crowning achievements and a wonderfully subtle and detailed approach to difficult themes. Still, this is my opinion. I saw you gave a 1 to Amour, should I start attacking you for your taste? Because I could definitely say this: 'He gave a 1 to Amour! He's misrepresenting (?) the film and Riva's performance!' and all this ridiculous nonsense. Art is subjective. I think you know that, don't you? But to claim that Lawrence had dialogue which makes her performance more demanding than Riva's is completely ridiculous. Since when having to deliver a lot of lines means that the performance is better than an (almost) silent one? I guess we should trash Samantha Morton's performance in 'Morvern Callar' because she barely has any substantial dialogue in the film. This makes no sense at all.

Concerning Lawrence's performance, I thought it was a mess with no depth at all. What kind of strong dialogue did she really have? And what kind of depth did she bring to this cliche character? Does Jennifer Lawrence have charisma? She does. Is this enough to claim that this is a worthy performance? Not to me.


Now, that's enough. If you want to talk about this, you could send me a PM. Your arrogance and attitude towards the vast majority of the AD members has always been annoying, but this personal attack is on a totally different level. I end this argument here.

I'm not attacking your taste, you're free to hate whatever you want and to vote whatever you want to vote. I was putting into perspective your attempt at ridiculing Lawrence's performance. Your hatred for everything Oscar is notorious. I haven't had to track "your posts", lol, you wish. All those polls are recent and I had already noticed the fact that you like to give the lowest scores (your vote is alone in many of those instances). It was an easy find.

All those paragraphs above are ruffled feathers, but nowhere in that long rant there is a defence on why you misrepresented Lawrence’s performance that much. You said all her lines are “You’re an asshole!” and things like that. That is not true. Yet you dared to put three (not one) “lol” emoticons at my saying that Lawrence’s role is more difficult because she doesn’t have to act vegetable for half her film, but instead has to navigate through lots and lots of dialogue that has to be alternatively snappy, cocky, vulnerable and sad. Instead of arguing that, you preferred to ridicule things, put lol emoticons and misrepresent her work. That was the whole point of my post: to show you (and everybody) how your hyperbole comes from a very clear place: you’re hyperbolically voting with below 5 grades everything nominated for Oscars that’s not Amour. So your hyperbolic misrepresentation of Lawrence’s performance is equally nutty. You have every right to be so hyperbolic in your reactions, but don’t act all outraged that I expose it, especially when you decided to start the argument with THREE “lol” emoticons trying to ridicule what I was saying. If you wanted this to be a civilized discussion on acting you should have started your post in a different way. If you’re acting hyperbolically, expect sarcasm and hyperbole in my retorts. Especially when you’re acting hyperbolically everywhere, not just here.

PS: I must say that “I have relatives with mental illness” is about as interesting as, I don’t know, one of Haha’s “I have got gay friends” arguments. Like, dear, we all have first hand knowledge of mental illness. Including the people who made this movie. So LOL at that too.

[riczhang]

Do people know how hard Cotillard and Dujardin campaingned to brick back Oscar in France ?

They almost won every vote one hand-shake at a time.

The did it for 6 MONTHS, 24/7.

Sometimes campaign doesn't matter but still.

Michael Barker's been running a ridiculously tight knit under the Public radar campaign. SPC's pushing Amour just as hard if not harder than Harvey's pushing SLP.
Secondly, Riva not campaigning is a lie. The accurate truthful statement is that she isn't campaigning anywhere as hard as her competitors. When she was in LA last month she did some handshaking, interviews, and academy pandering. She's still doing academy interviews now that she's back in France. She's done a remarkable amount of interviews and campaigning for an 85 year old.