Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 34

Thread: Justified: Season 4

  1. #1
    Christmas Time, You're So Fine! Bean's Avatar
    Join Date: Dec 2007
    Posts: 6,042

    Justified: Season 4



    This is back next week! Holy shit!

    I thought Season 3 was a step down from 2, but then the latter is one of my favorite seasons of TV ever, so....I was still wild about it. I'm very curious to see how they plan to keep Raylan and Boyd spinning this season, since last got a little overstuffed before the masterful finale.

  2. #2
    Delicate Flower
    Join Date: Dec 2007
    Location: Butt Fucking Your Children
    Posts: 12,387
    Wow, I didn't realize this was on in five days?!?! AWESOME.

  3. #3
    Christmas Time, You're So Fine! Bean's Avatar
    Join Date: Dec 2007
    Posts: 6,042
    I liked the premiere, though it seemed a bit lighter than those of the past two seasons. Maybe that was just Patton Oswalt's presence though? Anyway, I like that the immediate driver for Raylan isn't another "bad guy of the year," but winds back towards Arlo. Also, Boyd facing down a born-again preacher sounds fan-freaking-tastic.

  4. #4
    It's not going to stop 'til you wise up. Dent's Avatar
    Join Date: Dec 2007
    Location: Greendale Community College
    Posts: 8,564
    That born-again preacher is freakin' Tim from Jurassic Park.

    But yes, seeing Boyd tap into his revivalist roots (supplemented, apparently, by Isaac Asimov) to go up against that guy is gonna be amazing.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Dent View Post
    That born-again preacher is freakin' Tim from Jurassic Park.

    But yes, seeing Boyd tap into his revivalist roots (supplemented, apparently, by Isaac Asimov) to go up against that guy is gonna be amazing.
    Yeah, Joe Mazello. It's been funny seeing him pop up in things as an adult (he had three lines or so in The Social Network too).

  6. #6
    My religion is hedonism Aurelius's Avatar
    Join Date: Dec 2007
    Location: With Rania from Giordania
    Posts: 11,805
    Can we see more of that bounty hunter woman please? Preferably naked again .

    Anyway, nice season opener. Loved the moment with the airbag.



    I will marshall all the forces of darkness to hound you to an assisted suicide - Peter Capaldi, In The Loop

  7. #7
    It's not going to stop 'til you wise up. Dent's Avatar
    Join Date: Dec 2007
    Location: Greendale Community College
    Posts: 8,564
    Between the sequence at the Truths and the phenomenal Boyd/Preacher Tim showdown, this was a heck of an episode. This season's off to a great start. The Boyd plotline with the church looks to be a fucking blast, and the way the major mystery is slowly enfolding everyone into it is really cool. And hey, Wynn Duffy!
    Last edited by Dent; 01-17-2013 at 01:00 AM.

  8. #8
    Senior Member simplican's Avatar
    Join Date: Dec 2007
    Location: About town
    Posts: 1,113
    This show is just marvelous. Tonight's outing did a wonderful job of giving good material to pretty much every character (Wynn's mention of Devil was hilarious) while really advancing some plot lines.

    I'm sort of terrified of seeing how the preacher's sister will plot revenge.

  9. #9
    Senior Member
    Join Date: Dec 2007
    Posts: 2,213
    There is something tremendously heartbreaking about Ellen May. Earlier in the season, Ava made the comment to Boyd that she was waiting for "Daddy" to get home to decide what to do after Ellen May had shot at the trick. But the family is anything but. Ava had already broken the bond of trust between her and Ellen May. She did so when she punched Ellen May in the face in season 3 crossing into physical abuse of the woman who had put her life in Ava's hands. That act (recalled in episode 1) and Ellen May's hopelessness made her talk with Rev. Billy a moving sequence (even more so as Mazello's performance, with it's brilliant physical language and sublime line readings, came across as utterly sincere). A desire for redemption and salvation possible in a dead end life. A chance at an atmosphere where she feels safe (at "home") which is all Ellen May really desires. The desire for a do over for an addict and victim of physical abuse.

    Meanwhile, Ava and Boyd attempt to rationalize their acts. Boyd can attempt to sidestep responsibility but as he walked away in episode 4 his conscience betrays him across his face. He did not expect Rev. Billy to die for he expected Rev. Billy was not a believer but an exploiter. And while Rev. Billy may have exhibited hubris, it was marked by faith. Boyd is correct when he explains the pitfalls of doing without reason to Ellen May at the beginning of tonight's episode. It does not however absolve himself of his part in the death that unfolded. And now Ava rationalizes Ellen May being killed. It is a distressing sequence. We comprehend Boyd would do this. But we hope Ava cannot go there. And it is devastating when she does.

    The creators of Justified know that Boyd and Ava are beloved characters by many (myself included). I think they may be the most chemistry heavy couple on tv. But the creators know that Boyd is a person with a great deal of blood on his hands. And while Ava's killing of the vile Delroy is understandable, the decision to have Ellen May killed is a betrayal of Ava's humanity. It is the darkest we have ever seen her. The show trusts it's fans to know that, no matter how much it makes sense as a strategic move to protect their freedom, the act of killing Ellen May is indefensible.

    Therefore the end could be considered an out. We see that not only is Ava conflicted but Colton (who it turns out is an addict just like Ellen May) is upset about having to commit the act. By failing to kill Ellen May, we are saved from complete condemnation of Ava. For now there is maybe a chance down the line for Ava to redeem herself with the finality of Ellen May's fate not hanging permanently over her. Even better, we see Ellen May is not as naive as she appeared (the sequence is an interesting alternative to the fateful ride of Adrianna on The Sopranos). If the idiocy of her bringing up the secret to Ava right before leaving was a move that seemingly sealed her fate, she thankfully picks up on where her ride is really headed. By Ava and Boyd making their decision, they have made it worse upon themselves. I would not be surprised if Ellen May goes to the one other person left where she thinks she may find help - Cassie.

    As great as that storyline is, Raylan's is just as brilliantly played out. The series has incorporated Tim more into Raylan's stories this season and now we get more Rachel. I am not one of those who feels their lack of screentime is a flaw but it is always welcome to see them (Justified characters are so compelling that it never seems to be a case of getting annoyed with anyone's screentime being at the expense of someone else's). Raylan plays well off of both. Rachel teaching a lesson to the man who was warned about the blade is priceless and she makes the right move giving Raylan a weapon that is perfect for the confrontation with Randall. I also love Rachel and Raylan at the mansion (the female fighter also brings it in those scenes including the flirting and that throwaway as she seems turned on by Raylan's quick emasculation of the creep). I remained foolishly hopeful (but knew better) that Lindsay would end up still with Raylan at the end. But what can you do. At least she had even less interest in Randall. After all it is only Raylan that she soothes before she leaves both behind. Then I tell myself not so fast. After all, it is logically the wise move to allow Raylan the be the one left with an advantage over the ultra-violent Randall (who would attempt to follow Lindsay after all). That makes more sense than Lindsay having a sentimental favorite.

    Favorite bits

    Shelby and Cassie's talk - Shelby saying what he really feels about Boyd is made funnier with the knowledge Boyd is listening in. Then hanging up. Shelby could not make it clearer that he really dislikes Boyd. Beaver and Pulsipher are both terrific here.
    That shared moment between Raylan and the cashier.
    The brightness of the screen as Lindsay fades out of Raylan's life.
    Raylan did make it clear to Randall not to bring up chickens again!
    Raylan going to his bed and falling asleep, his face in the pillow.
    Colton tearing up. So he is not some emotionless thug. Still a thug but there is something there.
    The way that Lindsay and Ellen May's stories both ended tonight with them disappearing. One probably permanently and one setting up some serious complications.

    While Boardwalk Empire made a radical improvement and Breaking Bad was pretty darn strong again, Justified again seems to be operating at a higher level than any drama on tv imo. The acting and writing is as fantastic as ever and the plotlines are keeping one ready for next week to get here. But it's biggest plus (more so than the subtlety in it's themes, it's rich, snappy dialogue, and it's ability to seemingly pick the right actor/actress for every single role) may just be it's sense of humor.

    One more thing, Raylan and Rachel had some chemistry going there. The thing about Raylan is he could have chemistry with pretty much everyone. Olyphant is just a magnetic screen presence. But there was something I found intoxicating in Raylan and Rachel's interplay.
    Last edited by ldw; 01-30-2013 at 01:52 AM.

  10. #10
    Eternal Lurker
    Join Date: Dec 2007
    Location: Where you live
    Posts: 4,904
    I've enjoyed the first four episodes (haven't seen the most recent one yet) but I'm kinda shocked that they killed off Joseph Mazzello's character so quickly. His character was interesting enough to keep around until the end of the season. . Can't say the same about Lindsay or her husband.

    Also, I never expected this show to have a character quote a Spice Girls song.

  11. #11
    Delicate Flower
    Join Date: Dec 2007
    Location: Butt Fucking Your Children
    Posts: 12,387
    That proposal?!

    The last two episodes have been just about perfect, and I loved the scene right before the proposal where Ava tells Boyd that she regrets what they've done to Ella Mae.

  12. #12
    I keep thinking about is how much time has passed since the first season. Isn't it only supposed to be like a year or something? She tried to kill him a year ago! Oh, how times change.

  13. #13
    My religion is hedonism Aurelius's Avatar
    Join Date: Dec 2007
    Location: With Rania from Giordania
    Posts: 11,805
    Quote Originally Posted by bryan1311 View Post
    That proposal?!

    The last two episodes have been just about perfect, and I loved the scene right before the proposal where Ava tells Boyd that she regrets what they've done to Ella Mae.
    That scene made me question the full sincerity of the proposal. It felt to me Boyd would have always kept that proposal under wraps until he was cornered by a situation like in that scene.



    I will marshall all the forces of darkness to hound you to an assisted suicide - Peter Capaldi, In The Loop

  14. #14
    My guess is Boyd doesn't make it to next season. His empire building has been flawed. Too many people who want him dead (Johnny, Winn-Duffy, preacher's sister), Shelby turning on him also proves Boyd isn't nearly intimidating enough and he should've sniffed out Colton being a loose wheel by now, but wouldn't do in his friend. Boyd's problem is his heart isn't really in being the Don of Harlem County. He wants to do it for the same reason he became a neo-nazi, preacher or clean mine worker. It's a way to make himself feel appreciated and loved. His convo with Ava proved what he really cares about is family. Like Stringer Bell, when a kingpin starts to lose control of his pieces on the board, his reign isn't going to last long. Also Justified killing someone huge at the end of this season just seems like it fits timing wise. If not Boyd, probably Ava gets it

  15. #15
    Christmas Time, You're So Fine! Bean's Avatar
    Join Date: Dec 2007
    Posts: 6,042
    I think it's definitely been a point of this season that Boyd is off his game. I dunno that they can or should ever dispatch him, but some kind of comeuppance is definitely in the offing.

  16. #16
    Senior Member
    Join Date: Sep 2012
    Posts: 564
    if it's anyone i bet it would be ava and that catapults boyd into the truly dangerous villain he could be. but actually i think they'd probably want to wait on that for the last season, where you know there has to be the final raylan-boyd showdown. i bet it doesn't happen this year yet

  17. #17
    Christmas Time, You're So Fine! Bean's Avatar
    Join Date: Dec 2007
    Posts: 6,042
    I wonder how long this show will run? It's already in season 4 and feels full of life, but most cable dramas pack it in around season 7, so...

  18. #18
    Senior Member
    Join Date: Sep 2012
    Posts: 564
    yeah, probably 7 seasons

  19. #19
    I AM YOUR KHALEESI! hurricanesmith's Avatar
    Join Date: Dec 2007
    Location: Lubitschin'
    Posts: 14,129
    Quote Originally Posted by Bean View Post
    I wonder how long this show will run? It's already in season 4 and feels full of life, but most cable dramas pack it in around season 7, so...
    I was at a talk with Graham Yost, and he said he thinks it should run about six seasons, but he has no firm plan in mind for how he wants to wrap things up.

    HS

  20. #20
    Senior Member
    Join Date: Dec 2007
    Posts: 2,213
    There is a moment where Raylan voices his assumption that Shelby is being controlled by Boyd Crowder. We know Shelby has, for all intents and purposes, severed that connection but Shelby's arrest of Boyd which soon follows hits hard. It isn't just that Raylan now knows he is mistaken about Shelby or that Boyd realizes that Shelby has made himself clear (no ambiguity of a hung up phone call). It is that Shelby is so relatable, another member of a large set of recurring characters that is fleshed out by the writers and the acting to a point that one is both glad to see Shelby laying down the law and fearful of Shelby's fate. Raylan is fearful of the latter too but Shelby's response makes it clear - he is very aware of the danger of Boyd but he must not waver. There is an angle there which concerns itself with a proud man reclaiming his pride. But there is a stronger sense that Shelby is a man who truly believes in justice and integrity. And killing a prostitute to save one's ass isn't either in Shelby's book. I love the teaming of Boyd and Shelby and their final talk. These two men understand each other now. There is a scene earlier in the episode when Raylan finds out Arlo's lawyer is Boyd's lawyer. It is moment where one wonders if she is on the Josiah kidnapping (after all we know Arlo wouldn't give her true information). The show does not disrespect the audience's intelligence. We know Raylan is a smart man who knows his hunches and knows coincidences should always be questioned. The moment Arlo's lawyer leaves the room, we know Raylan will follow her. The show does not need an unneeded exposition scene of Raylan going lets follow her. By we know Raylan and we know there is no way in hell he will not pick up on this.

    The episode plays on another of Justified's strengths in that it is able to draw a parallel to Tim's storyline to Shelby's without using a sledgehammer. Just as Shelby's loyalty to Boyd could only go so far, the same is true of Tim. Tim is there for his friend, fellow vet Mark. And he puts himself in a vulnerable position to help Mark. However right and wrong is what it is. It is one thing for Mark to pay off his debts. It is another for Mark to have just stolen from the drug dealer. Tim calms the situation the Tim way but his disgust with Mark is crystal clear. Mark may be a friend but Tim will not allow himself to wrong someone else (even a drug dealer) on Mark's behalf. When Art called Tim a ticking time bomb, it made sense. There has always been a coiled energy to Tim. The prior episode to this one had one of the most touching moments in Justified's history concerning Tim's reading material. In a few lines, we sense the tremendous loss and nightmares Tim has been forced to confront in his life. This makes his encounters with Colton that much more powerful. If Tim suffers from PTSD received while fighting for his country, Colton is another wounded soul. In two scenes, it is evident there is a bond between these two men. The same empathy Tim feels for Mark can be sensed for Colton. When Tim said Colton could try out for the Marshall services it was not empty talk. Instead a man telling a fellow vet that there is a good path that can be taken. When Tim and Colton meet again in this episode, there is again a sense of camraderie. An attachment that only shared, specific experience can provide.

    Colton is a pathetic figure but Eldard (and the writers) have created someone who is anything but one note henchman. He beats up two people in this episode and both scenes are marked by self loathing. As he unleashes violence, one gets a sense of man who is unleashing built up self-hatred. There is regret in his actions. One can sense a once good person once existed. One can see the flashes there but even then they are overmatched by the villainy he has fallen into (can any scene better document this than the sad, crushed look on his face as he takes Ellen May to what he thinks will be her faith).

    Justified has excelled yet again. Once it confounded expectations by rejecting a revisiting of the charismatic big bad storyline in season 3 with it's depictions of the just want to be left alone Limehouse and the screw up that was Quarles. Now it has one upped itself by having it's main investigation be about a ghost of a character. The story is, after all, not of Raylan vs. Drew Thompson. The story is of these wounded men and women, scarred by neglect and war and other demons. One where even the supporting characters such as Johnny and Ellen May are given a depth that the lead characters of many a show aren't given. One where even the smallest roles such as Roz and Cassie are given weight (I do think the latter will end up playing an even more crucial part by the end of this season).

    Justified's respect for it's audience shines again at the end. Boyd proposes to Ava and it is scene that conjures many emotions. I think these two have more chemistry than any other couple on television. Yet I know, thanks to Ellen May still being alive, that there is still hope for Ava. I don't see much for Boyd. He does not bring out the best in her. He brings out the dark in her. When they share that romantic moment I am reminded that they think Ellen May is dead on their orders, reminded of a woman holding her dying brother in her hands, and reminded of Shelby, a man trying to do right. The proposal is bittersweet for me. A romance that is both exciting and sinister. Justified conjures up such mixed emotions. It is a wonder to watch.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •